Beth asks,
I am going back to complete my BA or BS degree and am seriously considering HR. At my age of 47 (but attractive, fit and look much younger thankfully) are any companies hiring without prior experience with just a degree?
If the answer is NO…where can I get some experience w/o wasting valuable time I don’t have and/or acquire an internship position while going to school?
If the answer is YES…which area of HR is most needed since this is your area of expertise? What is the growth rate expectation as it will take me about 2.5 yrs. to complete since I will have to re-take some classes that are over 10 yrs. in the past. Marketing? Mgmt? Adm.?
Please advise and I CAN take the truth! LOL. Thanks.
Beth, it sounds like you are going back to school to earn more money and land a serious, stable job. If that’s true, don’t study Human Resources. Go back to school and become a paralegal, a physical therapist, or a drug counselor. Get a degree in finance or computer science.
HR is flawed and its future is being debated in the halls of Corporate America. No university can prepare you for what you face in the workforce as a Human Resources practitioner, either. Good HR people have years of experience, and it’s a big investment of time and energy to get really good. Often times, HR people earn less than teachers.
My advice? Stay away. Stay far away from HR. Don’t waste your time.
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And now for something completely different…..I’m going to take an optimistic view……
I think this is hard to comment on without knowing what other transferable experience the individual has. One of the problems with HR is that its full of HR people and therefore is too introspective and up its own bottom.
Someone with good line management experience could easily transfer in to a generalist HR role. Someone with good financial experience could easily transfer into a comp and ben role.
It is possible…in my opinion, but like any career change you need to be clear what else you are bringing to the party.
As for degrees in computer science….these are ten a penny. Surely only of benefit if you want to relocate to Mumbai?
I agree with TheHRD – it depends upon your transferrable skills. Remember that positions that require little to no experience pay little to no money. You need experience to make decent money and you probably don’t want to take the $35k job to get the experience. My advice, choose another major.
@Bonita: For lots of folks, a $35k job, esp as an entry-level, would be VERY decent money!
I’m also guessing that if Beth is going back for an undergraduate degree, she hasn’t ever made much more than that, and also may not have management or finance experience to replace the HR experience she doesn’t have either. She might be newly divorced, or re-entering the job market after many years at home with kids.
Laurie is probably right here: at this point, I’d suggest that unless a 47 yr old woman who is returning to school (probably with a story) has the financial margin and super-human stamina to follow a potentially-unprofitable passion (if HR is her passion), she should aim for a “ready to wear” degree that she can hit the ground and get a job with. But I’m not a “dream killer” either — career-building is an ongoing process and needn’t stop at that first job.
I just took a look at my state’s SHRM chapter job boards and of the 7 positions available only 1 was not looking for 3-5 years of HR experience. The one position was an entry level HR admin role.
I recently received my Master’s Degree in HRM (I also have a BS in Social Work). I got lucky, my company saw a need to bring in someone with a Counseling background into the Employee Relations side of the house; the fact I was getting my MSHRM was a bonus for them. Prior to that I was working as an IT Project Manager for the same company…..again something that my tech deficient HR department needed.
I doubt seriously I would have been able to find a HR job anywhere else because of that “experience” clause. So I would say before you make a decision; talk to your company’s HR leaders (if you are currently employed) to see if you can fill a need they have. Otherwise I agree with Laurie, choose a degree that will serve you well outside of the corporate world.
Honestly, is this site still Punk HR or just Anti HR now? HR is being *embraced* by Corporate America. Of course, if your idea of HR is answering people’s questions about health coverage or pay stub in accuracies, then yes, your career outlook is bleak since anyone can do that job and since that kind of work is being outsourced anyway. However, companies need brainy people who can strategically align their workforce with their mission. They need people who can keep employees engaged, work with labor unions, forecast the effects of new legislation, quantify human capital, and measures its impact on the bottom line.
Beth, good entry-level HR jobs at big companies, the one’s that pay six figures, require an MBA or master’s degree in HR. Work experience in this case is not necessary but helpful. Boutique companies will hire people for HR positions with only a bachelor’s degree, but since the entry barrier is lower, you do have to compete based on work experience. Some people are able to transition over to HR from a different function within the business and get their start in HR that way, so you may be able to get in that way. I would encourage you to be very deliberate in your education, seeing which companies actively recruit from your program of study and finding out what they are looking for specifically.
I would dispute the entry level 6 figure positions in HR that JD mentions. If there are any true entry level jobs paying that much at corporations, I’d like to know, as I would shit on their stock for being so stupid as to pay over 100K for a jackass with no experience. I’d love so see those ROI metrics.
Beth, here’s a secret: unless you are planning to cure cancer, or invent the most awesome renewable energy source, odds are at the end of the day, your degree doesn’t mean crap for what you want to do. I have a BS in Secondary Education and I haven’t been in a highschool classroom since high school, but I’ve been in HR for almost 20 years and have had a rewarding career. However, it wasn’t what I learned in college that mattered to getting into HR or for that matter helped me in my career. Here’s that secret that I alluded to: Your career success is based on this: Do people like you? It doesn’t matter how smart you are, our how many trailers you have after your name, an asshole is an asshole, and no one wants to work with an asshole, but people will bend over backwards to work with charismatic people. Are you someone that others flock too? If you aren’t someone that people will follow at this point in the game, then I’d recommend pursuing a different career.
The future of HR aside, current-state HR in most organizations is quite diverse. Analytic minded? You can thrive in compensation or (in forward-thinking organizations) workforce analytics. Love to develop people? Great opportunity to do so in L&D or Talent Development. Enjoy problem-solving and employee relations? HR business partners do this all day long. My HR organization even includes a PMO, security (both physical and intellectual property) and corporate services.
My point to Beth is — start with an examination of your values, talents and interests, and then look outward to match what YOU want with what HR has (or doesn’t have) to provide. You may find a good match and will want to figure out a way to get into HR. Or, you may find that your penchant for analysis can be filled, and compensated more highly, in a business analytics function. Or your desire to develop people might lead to a long-term goal as a line manager in an operations function. I second Puf’s point (as a fellow secondary ed degree holder) that in the very long run, your undergrad degree will matter little and your level of emotional intelligence and drive to do good work will matter more and more. Best of luck.
An old boss once put it to me this way: “What other job can you get where the rest of the employee base thinks they know how to do your job better than you do?” Who doesn’t have an opinion about your health care provider? Who doesn’t have a friend who needs a job?
I hate to be negative here, but before anyone decides to become a paralegal, they should definitely check out salaries/hiring information in their area.
That’s my first degree. I didn’t find out until I graduated that where I live, no one will hire a paralegal – they hire a “legal secretary” for less pay, and you still wind up doing paralegal work! The worst part, I was competing for jobs with people who barely graduated high school, and more often than not, I was being passed over *because* of my degree.
I’ve been told that this is true in small towns all over, but that degreed paralegals do very well in larger cities, because the firms are larger and younger associates and partners are more willing to pay what they’re worth.
I agree with Laurie on this one – stay away. I would suggest instead something stable – like teaching where less experience yet having maturity is a nice benefit when job searching…
You can avoid drug counselor unless you enjoy heart ache and low pay. Despite the 300-600 dollar a day rate for drug and alcohol rehab the counselors make very little. Median salary for a new counselor is less than 30,000. I would love to be a chemical dependency counselor but the pay cut would kill my dreams of retirement.
John
Lol! so true Laurie- I guess i don’t have to feel so bad that I don’t have ANY formal training/education in this field.
I’m in the organization I’m in because of family and because they need ‘intelligent’ and trustworthy people. I get all the info and knowledge I can by reading and talking to my mom (who has been in HR for like 20+ years and is mostly experienced based).
Ironically enough I started out as a TA and i WAS EARNING MORE $$!!
Good advice, Laurie. Truly.
@HRPufnstuf:
You can discount the value of a degree because you have one. I guarantee if you never got that degree you would be stuck making $14-16/hr even with experience. I don’t have a degree, so I know of what I speak. You remind me of the guy who taught my Microsoft Networking certification class back in 1998. He had a BS in Electrical Engineering, and several certifications, and said the Microsoft certification has turned out to be the most important. The only reason that is true is because he already has a degree. He wouldn’t be saying that if he had no degree.
I think employers want a degree mainly as a metric of your intelligence and responsibility. Whether a degree means you are intelligent and responsible is debatable, but it does mean you have some education, and that’s close enough for them I guess.
@David T. – Most of the recruiters I’ve had working for me, have not had degrees and earned between $75,000 and $150,000. My wife is non-degreed but earns $78 an hour as a clinical data manager. My best friend does not have a degree earns over $100k a year running his own business. I’ve never denied anyone work because they didn’t have a degree. Should I go on? I got my degree because the Army paid for it, but it doesn’t make me smarter than anyone else. The metric isn’t intelligence. The most actual metric is component of share holder value. Share holders equate education with potential results (although, there is strong evidence to the contrary), and the ratio of degrees in an organization is a way to show that measurement.
Do NOT degree in HR. That said, do get a degree in something, but don’t limit yourself with an HR course of study. Every person I know who works in HR got there by starting in some sort of administrative or bus. dev. role with their company.
Frankly, if I could handle blood and other people’s icky issues, I’d go into healthcare in a heartbeat.
I disagree that HR is a dying career. I do it every day and see how completely dependent employers are on those of us who do it well. Large corporations are bloated entities that have little interest in changing their infrastructure, effective or not. (Not to mention that lots of managers don’t like to do the dirty work that comes with employee supervision.) Mid-sized companies need HR because we do a crapload more than just the daily generalist gig. It’s a multiple-niche job for most people at smaller companies (meaning under 200 employees).
I like my job, but would I choose it all over again? I dunno. I fell into it, and there are days when I really enjoy it, and there are days when I want to drive straight to the airport and get on the first plane to anywhere but here. But that’s true with any job here in the real world.
And, Laurie’s right, don’t count on making big bucks in HR. Bottom line, you have to enjoy the work. You’ll hear fanciful tales about VP’s of HR making fat dollars, but that aint reality for most of us. Plus, we pay for lots of stuff ourselves that our companies can’t anymore (re-cert/continuing ed, in particular), yet somehow we’re supposed to be able to run with the C-Suite, who all enjoy expensive hobbies, of course. I’m just thrilled I’m finally working with executives who don’t all golf! I sure can’t afford to do that.
As a firm that places HR professionals, we frequently speak with individuals that have no HR experience, then return to school to get a master’s degree in HR, and find it difficult to actually land an HR position. As an earlier writer indicates, they may be able to land an entry level opportunity, however, these more senior individuals find it difficult to take that big of a pay cut to begin a new career. Additionally, with all of the “business dislocations” of the last decade, they are competing with well qualified, experienced HR proessionals for generalist positions. This has been our experience..and yet when we share that information with our candidates..they have a difficult time accepting this information!
bonny
I don’t know about the future of HR as a whole but I know that the salaries of the HR managers and HR directors I’ve worked with have been pretty nice (80k-100k). That said, they had a lot of experience under their belts, not to mention resources like their certifications and tireless networking skillz.
I’m an HR coordinator now, with 3 years experience and a master’s degree and I can tell you that anyone can do this job, but I got hired because of my degree (although for what I’m being paid, you wouldn’t know it, hah). I tend to lament the money I spent on that degree because now I’m not sure if HR is what I want to do long-term but I know that it has landed me a fairly secure job for now.
What’s up with this idea that you can’t make any money in HR? How is this even remotely true? No, you won’t get rich off your entry level job, but that’s the norm today in most professions. My current and previous supervisor both make (what I consider to be) very solid money. They put time and effort into obtaining those roles, but that’s just like every other industry. They will never own mansions but they are beyond “comfortable”. Is that not good enough?
@TheHRD You made me crap my pants. Wow. That was very optimistic and constructive. Will wonders never cease??
@Bonita So wise, so wise.
@almost There’s always a story. I dunno. Maybe THAT STORY is the way to make money? I’d start a blog about that story.
@Lori Whoa that’s very helpful advice. Thanks!
@JD This site is anti-status-quo. Until HR changes, I’m probably in the anti-HR camp. Except that I only know HR & recruiting, so I’m a self-loathing HR professional. It’s sad. I need therapy and more Xanax.
@Puf It’s all about likeability. True.
@Kristy Thanks for being an optimist and weighing in with some great advice.
@HRPuter Exactly. Those are other reasons to hate HR jobs. Emotionally unfulfilling and everyone has an opinion.
@Guin Dammit. Legal secretaries??? What is this world coming to…
@Sarah I think teaching is a tough job. I wouldn’t do it. Some teachers make good money and others make dirt money — but the last HR assistant I hired earned $35K/year. I don’t think that is great money for a woman with a degree + kids + a car + a house + insurance. All that education & student loans. Seems like a waste.
@JohnC I thought chemical dependency counselors did okay. I’ll have to do some research.
@Karen Thank goodness you didn’t pay to go to school & then get that job!
@Ken Thanks!
@H.Aria Good comments but I still think HR is dying. I need to write a post about it and really dig deep — but every time I try, I bore myself. Isn’t that sad? Maybe we should *both* go into health care.
@Bonny Thank you so much for that insight!
@gHRunt HR is not a bad field and (IMHO) men tend to earn more money in HR than women. I was a corporate recruiter & HR generalist for years. I supervised teams. I worked globally. I won’t do it, again, unless it’s on my terms.
@Shawn You can make money in HR. Sure. Can a woman who graduates from college at the age of 50 make any money in HR? Maybe. I don’t think the ROI for her college education is there.
I would just offer one more comment on the HR pay issue. gHRunt mentioned the sweet salaries for managers & directors, and I would agree…about 2 to 5 years ago. We are in a whole new world now. With the number of HR directors/managers having been laid off in the past year, don’t count on seeing HR pay increasing to that level again. I’m lucky in that I wasn’t the director so I got to keep my job, but not lucky in that they can get all the HR work out of me at a much lower pay rate. Unfortunately, I don’t think any employee who’s suffered pay cuts in this recession can count on seeing pay restoration anytime soon.