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	<title>Comments on: Creative People, Superstars, and Unemployment</title>
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	<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/</link>
	<description>Anti-Establishment Career Advice</description>
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		<title>By: BZTAT</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14767</link>
		<dc:creator>BZTAT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Aug 2009 20:40:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14767</guid>
		<description>@mouse--would love to hear more about your business and how it works.

@Ann--How do we traverse the precipice?

BZTAT</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@mouse&#8211;would love to hear more about your business and how it works.</p>
<p>@Ann&#8211;How do we traverse the precipice?</p>
<p>BZTAT</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ann</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14764</link>
		<dc:creator>ann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Aug 2009 19:08:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14764</guid>
		<description>funny, we were just talking about something similar over at Waiting for the Muse....   I&#039;m with BZ in that the creatives and business people just see each other as opposites and don&#039;t realize that can help each other.  I&#039;m an artist as well as a creativity &amp; PR consultant.... having worked freelance for many years now after leaving the media world (radio news in the mid 80s).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>funny, we were just talking about something similar over at Waiting for the Muse&#8230;.   I&#8217;m with BZ in that the creatives and business people just see each other as opposites and don&#8217;t realize that can help each other.  I&#8217;m an artist as well as a creativity &amp; PR consultant&#8230;. having worked freelance for many years now after leaving the media world (radio news in the mid 80s).</p>
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		<title>By: mouse</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14591</link>
		<dc:creator>mouse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jul 2009 05:56:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14591</guid>
		<description>And thus my business was born.  I do independent admin work and most of my clients are the little non-profit theatre companies I work with (techie/actor combo, preferably both in the same play).  I&#039;m like a temp agency without the agency.  Awesome.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And thus my business was born.  I do independent admin work and most of my clients are the little non-profit theatre companies I work with (techie/actor combo, preferably both in the same play).  I&#8217;m like a temp agency without the agency.  Awesome.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: BZTAT</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14572</link>
		<dc:creator>BZTAT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:03:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14572</guid>
		<description>@Totem--Been mulling your thoughts over a bit...

&quot;The vast majority of the art created during the Renaissance was painted at the behest of, and to the specifications, of patrons.&quot;

&quot;But by the standards of many in the art world today, these great artists would be “sell-outs feeding the corporate/public/money machine.”

Ever heard of the famous artist Anonymous? Suspicions are that Anon was a woman...

Ever heard of any famous African American artists before the 20th century? Me either. Wonder why?

Seems that it all boils down to the &quot;Haves&quot; and &quot;Have-nots&quot;, or the ones with cultural advantage vs. those with none. Talent has nothing to do with it.

I have no quibble with the amazing genius of DaVinci, whose talent was so immense, even the damp tastes of his patrons could not suppress his virtuosity. It is sad to me, though, that there were others who were his contemporaries who did not have his advantages of connection to the &quot;Establishment&quot;. Women could not afford the oil paints and canvases in those days, much less could they afford to step out of their place in the kitchen.  Imagine what our world may have been like if they had...

Should we just capitulate to the way that things are, or should we push for change in our culture?  

In the context of this blog, and all matters practical in regards to employment and economic success, I am fighting a losing battle I presume.  Yes, we all have our needs to get by and all cannot (and really should not) sacrifice their personal needs to change the system.  But does that mean that we should assume that those who do make those sacrifices for their art are thinking that they are &quot;too brilliant and talented for a traditional job&quot; as Laurie suggested?

Totem, I heard the same criticisms that you did when I was in art school.  I continue to hear it now, as I paint for commission and I do not buy into the Goth angst that is the art d&#039;jour. I have a commitment to my vision, though, and although feedback is always given consideration, it does not stop me.  I find that artists who are not selling their work tend to justify their lack of sales by calling those who do &quot;sell-outs&quot;.

I also have a traditional job, although over the past year have taken all kinds of risks by making that part time as I pursue developing my art career. You may all be saying &quot;I told you so&quot; soon.

I get back to my original point.  Most artists, by virtue of excelling in right brain activities, are seriously lacking in the left brain skills that it takes to excel at business. How can we develop non-exploitative and non-disparate partnerships between artists and practical business folks so that artists, businesses and the entire cultural landscape can benefit from fresh creative vision?

You may call me a dreamer, but I&#039;m not the only one...

And if anyone is wondering, I have paid my cell phone bill this month. Rent and truck payments are questionable though.

Shameless plug: www.artadventuresstudios.com

BZ</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Totem&#8211;Been mulling your thoughts over a bit&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8220;The vast majority of the art created during the Renaissance was painted at the behest of, and to the specifications, of patrons.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;But by the standards of many in the art world today, these great artists would be “sell-outs feeding the corporate/public/money machine.”</p>
<p>Ever heard of the famous artist Anonymous? Suspicions are that Anon was a woman&#8230;</p>
<p>Ever heard of any famous African American artists before the 20th century? Me either. Wonder why?</p>
<p>Seems that it all boils down to the &#8220;Haves&#8221; and &#8220;Have-nots&#8221;, or the ones with cultural advantage vs. those with none. Talent has nothing to do with it.</p>
<p>I have no quibble with the amazing genius of DaVinci, whose talent was so immense, even the damp tastes of his patrons could not suppress his virtuosity. It is sad to me, though, that there were others who were his contemporaries who did not have his advantages of connection to the &#8220;Establishment&#8221;. Women could not afford the oil paints and canvases in those days, much less could they afford to step out of their place in the kitchen.  Imagine what our world may have been like if they had&#8230;</p>
<p>Should we just capitulate to the way that things are, or should we push for change in our culture?  </p>
<p>In the context of this blog, and all matters practical in regards to employment and economic success, I am fighting a losing battle I presume.  Yes, we all have our needs to get by and all cannot (and really should not) sacrifice their personal needs to change the system.  But does that mean that we should assume that those who do make those sacrifices for their art are thinking that they are &#8220;too brilliant and talented for a traditional job&#8221; as Laurie suggested?</p>
<p>Totem, I heard the same criticisms that you did when I was in art school.  I continue to hear it now, as I paint for commission and I do not buy into the Goth angst that is the art d&#8217;jour. I have a commitment to my vision, though, and although feedback is always given consideration, it does not stop me.  I find that artists who are not selling their work tend to justify their lack of sales by calling those who do &#8220;sell-outs&#8221;.</p>
<p>I also have a traditional job, although over the past year have taken all kinds of risks by making that part time as I pursue developing my art career. You may all be saying &#8220;I told you so&#8221; soon.</p>
<p>I get back to my original point.  Most artists, by virtue of excelling in right brain activities, are seriously lacking in the left brain skills that it takes to excel at business. How can we develop non-exploitative and non-disparate partnerships between artists and practical business folks so that artists, businesses and the entire cultural landscape can benefit from fresh creative vision?</p>
<p>You may call me a dreamer, but I&#8217;m not the only one&#8230;</p>
<p>And if anyone is wondering, I have paid my cell phone bill this month. Rent and truck payments are questionable though.</p>
<p>Shameless plug: <a href="http://www.artadventuresstudios.com" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/www.artadventuresstudios.com?referer=');">http://www.artadventuresstudios.com</a></p>
<p>BZ</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: BZTAT</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14556</link>
		<dc:creator>BZTAT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 04:47:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14556</guid>
		<description>@Ian &amp; @Totem

Does that mean that, if it is the way it has always been, it is the way that it always shall be?

I do not disagree that artists need to find patrons and that they need to market themselves. I do think that we need to find ways, though, to make it more possible for artists to do that without sacrificing their individual vision, and I think that we need to recognize that a good marketer does not always make a good artist.

@ME @Laurie And here I thought you were frustrated artists...Turns out you&#039;re frustrated weather girls!

BZ</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ian &amp; @Totem</p>
<p>Does that mean that, if it is the way it has always been, it is the way that it always shall be?</p>
<p>I do not disagree that artists need to find patrons and that they need to market themselves. I do think that we need to find ways, though, to make it more possible for artists to do that without sacrificing their individual vision, and I think that we need to recognize that a good marketer does not always make a good artist.</p>
<p>@ME @Laurie And here I thought you were frustrated artists&#8230;Turns out you&#8217;re frustrated weather girls!</p>
<p>BZ</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14555</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 04:23:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14555</guid>
		<description>@Totem

Yes! You&#039;re so right, thanks for bringing that up. It&#039;s the same with Dickens and Shakespeare. The Beatles got popular because of their marketing (in America at least, they were on a lunch box before they were on a stage). Even the Sex Pistols were (arguably) more a business model than a band. Good call!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Totem</p>
<p>Yes! You&#8217;re so right, thanks for bringing that up. It&#8217;s the same with Dickens and Shakespeare. The Beatles got popular because of their marketing (in America at least, they were on a lunch box before they were on a stage). Even the Sex Pistols were (arguably) more a business model than a band. Good call!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Low on the Totem Pole</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14547</link>
		<dc:creator>Low on the Totem Pole</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 23:44:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14547</guid>
		<description>The vast majority of the art created during the Rennisance was painted at the behest of, and to the specifications, of patrons.  Davinci was brilliant, but the art he painted for patrons was what paid the bills - all of his other stuff was done on the side to feed his &quot;creative soul.&quot;  Don&#039;t we still consider much of this art work to be the best the world has produced?  But by the standards of many in the art world today, these great artists would be &quot;sell-outs feeding the coroporate/public/money machine.&quot;

I stopped taking art classes in college when my professor gave me a bad grade for painting something &quot;pretty.&quot;  And my creative writing teacher once tried to insult my short story by telling me and the class that the best thing she could say about it was that it was &quot;marketable.&quot;  I said &quot;thank you.&quot;  I&#039;d rather eat than be &quot;true to my art.&quot;  :o)

You go Laurie!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The vast majority of the art created during the Rennisance was painted at the behest of, and to the specifications, of patrons.  Davinci was brilliant, but the art he painted for patrons was what paid the bills &#8211; all of his other stuff was done on the side to feed his &#8220;creative soul.&#8221;  Don&#8217;t we still consider much of this art work to be the best the world has produced?  But by the standards of many in the art world today, these great artists would be &#8220;sell-outs feeding the coroporate/public/money machine.&#8221;</p>
<p>I stopped taking art classes in college when my professor gave me a bad grade for painting something &#8220;pretty.&#8221;  And my creative writing teacher once tried to insult my short story by telling me and the class that the best thing she could say about it was that it was &#8220;marketable.&#8221;  I said &#8220;thank you.&#8221;  I&#8217;d rather eat than be &#8220;true to my art.&#8221;  <img src='http://punkrockhr.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_surprised.gif' alt=':o' class='wp-smiley' /> )</p>
<p>You go Laurie!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: MattyMat</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14540</link>
		<dc:creator>MattyMat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 21:01:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14540</guid>
		<description>Ok.. ok...OK!!  I&#039;m officially out of the closet!!  (my eyes are still adjusting.....  ok... hmmmm....)

Hey wait a minute!!---  you wanted the truth about working and striving to reach your artistic dreams at the same time--- and the f*cked-up compromise&#039;s that have to be made.  Laurie... there are thousands of great &quot;starving&quot; artists out there and the reality of the art world is, whether people want to deny it or not, what compromises are you willing to take and how far you&#039;re willing to go to get to your goal.  I wasn&#039;t willing to take that particular path, (ahem) thank you. (and it happened WAY more than once-- I was like &quot;here we go again!&quot;)

The bare naked truth really does f*ckin&#039; suck sometimes, doesn&#039;t it??</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok.. ok&#8230;OK!!  I&#8217;m officially out of the closet!!  (my eyes are still adjusting&#8230;..  ok&#8230; hmmmm&#8230;.)</p>
<p>Hey wait a minute!!&#8212;  you wanted the truth about working and striving to reach your artistic dreams at the same time&#8212; and the f*cked-up compromise&#8217;s that have to be made.  Laurie&#8230; there are thousands of great &#8220;starving&#8221; artists out there and the reality of the art world is, whether people want to deny it or not, what compromises are you willing to take and how far you&#8217;re willing to go to get to your goal.  I wasn&#8217;t willing to take that particular path, (ahem) thank you. (and it happened WAY more than once&#8211; I was like &#8220;here we go again!&#8221;)</p>
<p>The bare naked truth really does f*ckin&#8217; suck sometimes, doesn&#8217;t it??</p>
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		<title>By: Laurie</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14538</link>
		<dc:creator>Laurie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 20:57:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14538</guid>
		<description>@ME We. Are. Twins.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ME We. Are. Twins.</p>
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		<title>By: MeredithElaine</title>
		<link>http://punkrockhr.com/unemployment-3/#comment-14534</link>
		<dc:creator>MeredithElaine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 19:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punkrockhr.com/?p=4837#comment-14534</guid>
		<description>@Laurie - OMG, me too. I kinda used to watch The Weather Channel obsessively as a kid.  I wanted to be a meteorologist so bad, and let people know when the hurricanes were coming, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Laurie &#8211; OMG, me too. I kinda used to watch The Weather Channel obsessively as a kid.  I wanted to be a meteorologist so bad, and let people know when the hurricanes were coming, etc.</p>
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